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The Thing (as in the monster) needed special attention lately. It's pretty weak compared to Marines, and unless the Marines screw themselves over, the Thing is unlikely to win.
So I'm doing some buffs and nerfs. Here are some changes expected in 0.261, under development.
1. Flamethrower and Shield can no longer be simultaneously equipped.
2. Flamethrower and IR Goggles can no longer be simultaneously equipped.
3. Thing has an extended Transform to Marine system with quick keys to transform back to a previous color, last consumed color and original color.
Under Consideration:
Blood Test?
I'm still a firm believer that the Thing should not be able to use medkit, I actually want to remove the exception of using it with Marines in sight.
This might mean that there will be a "Blood Test" feature through the use of the limited and single use medkits, but such feature needs further thought.
FLAMETHROWER changes
The Flamethrower seems to be a volatile mechanic which can easily determine who wins. If there's no fuel, the Thing will probably win. If there's a flamethrower within a stable group, the Marines will probably win.
I'm thinking of adding something that takes away this volatility. Maybe a new structure which Marines can use to locate flamethrower (if on ground) and refuel flamethrower. Of course, this means nerfing the flamethrower's damage (to a small extent) and fuel capacity (to a great extent) as well.
I think if a new structure is introduced to refuel and locate Flamethrower, the Flamethrower shouldn't be able to kill Thing, maybe even at full capacity.
Anyway, expect the update by this week!
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Upcoming 0.261: What's New?
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Omg, so excited. Give me a minute to think so I can give some ideas on flamethrower and blood testing. Players continually suggested it while ingame so it'd be cool to see what that might turn into. Like I said, I need a minute to think :p
We could change the FRK building into the fueling station
Bloodtests
First, can I just ask the number of medkits that spawn on the map? (need to add it to wiki as well)
The number of medkits might need changing dependent on how many there are.
I like the idea of having a bloodtest. It would definitely help follow the whole "The Thing" theme. My one concern with using medkits is logic: How the fuck does the medkit item heal the marine but hurt the Thing? (We need to get crafty)
I feel like the whole healing thing would kind of go against the idea of a bloodtest. Take this for example: The Thing has successfully impersonated blue in the group. However, the Thing is lower on health than usual. A good teammate as he is, green, decides to heal his buddy blue. Congratulations, you just wrecked the Thing's whole plan by accidentally trying to help out a fellow marine.
Kind of shitty example, but you get the point. Also, it would kind of faze out the medkit because who the hell would use the medkit as a healer if you could just rule someone out as being the Thing?
Just my initial thoughts. Workarounds that you propose?
Flamethrower
THANK GOD. Someone else feels this way. At the start of the game, if the Thing happens to spawn next to the flame its pretty much gg for the marines. I'm ecstatic that some thought has gone into this.
Here's my interpretation of a change.
I like the idea of the building that could refuel it, in exchange for maximum fuel and damage being decreased. However, I also thought it was kind of pointless to have a building essentially designed for one marine, the one holding the flame. Then I started theory-crafting. What if the damage of the current flame was reduced by 50%, and the fuel by 50% but there were more than 1 flamethrower? (2 mainly, if stretching it, 3). Assuming it was 2 flames, the damage would be the same and the fuel would be 20% less than current. However, these statistics are only accepted if both marines with flames are standing beside eachother. If a marine is alone, they have 60% less fuel and 50% less damage each.
This means it is helpful if apart, but ultimately a great nerf to the item if you are in a group of 3. (Currently Thing vs. Group of 3 = Marines win if they have flame) People then start thinking, "What if they are together in a group? What is the difference?" Well, first of all both won't be able to shoot at the same time if they are being targeted. Imagine 2 flamers vs 1 Thing (or 2 marines vs 1 zealot). One of the 2 will always have to keep moving to avoid dying by the Thing. Even then, both flamers in the group will not always be shooting at the Thing. One may be shooting at in the front, and the other stuck in the back. Also, throwing a flamer away from the group and locking wouldn't result in a tough fight anymore. Currently, if you engage a group and throw the flamer outside and try to kill it, its a tough fight because so much damage per second. Alone, however, this much damage wouldn't be done.
The primary way the flamethrower mechanics would change for the better is it really doesn't matter if The Thing spawned next to the flame. You can always find it and use it again. The damage is less, so its still useful but not OP in any way. The fuel is also less, so its more of a treasure . More people can even use it (2 flamethrowers, remember?) so teamwork matters, and so does who you let have the flame.
What else would this offer?
Well, lets think logically. If grenades and molotovs are your only real damage dealers, and you have a limited amount, you will always want to travel to the Infernal Forge (My new name for it because it sounds cool) to get better weapons. (The flame) What did we just do? We just killed 2 birds with one stone. We just fixed volatile mechanics of the flamethrower AND promoted marines to move across the map and to NOT CAMP.
So that's my first idea. :3
Again, just theory-crafting. Feedback?
First, can I just ask the number of medkits that spawn on the map? (need to add it to wiki as well)
The number of medkits might need changing dependent on how many there are.
I like the idea of having a bloodtest. It would definitely help follow the whole "The Thing" theme. My one concern with using medkits is logic: How the fuck does the medkit item heal the marine but hurt the Thing? (We need to get crafty)
I feel like the whole healing thing would kind of go against the idea of a bloodtest. Take this for example: The Thing has successfully impersonated blue in the group. However, the Thing is lower on health than usual. A good teammate as he is, green, decides to heal his buddy blue. Congratulations, you just wrecked the Thing's whole plan by accidentally trying to help out a fellow marine.
Kind of shitty example, but you get the point. Also, it would kind of faze out the medkit because who the hell would use the medkit as a healer if you could just rule someone out as being the Thing?
Just my initial thoughts. Workarounds that you propose?
Flamethrower
THANK GOD. Someone else feels this way. At the start of the game, if the Thing happens to spawn next to the flame its pretty much gg for the marines. I'm ecstatic that some thought has gone into this.
Here's my interpretation of a change.
I like the idea of the building that could refuel it, in exchange for maximum fuel and damage being decreased. However, I also thought it was kind of pointless to have a building essentially designed for one marine, the one holding the flame. Then I started theory-crafting. What if the damage of the current flame was reduced by 50%, and the fuel by 50% but there were more than 1 flamethrower? (2 mainly, if stretching it, 3). Assuming it was 2 flames, the damage would be the same and the fuel would be 20% less than current. However, these statistics are only accepted if both marines with flames are standing beside eachother. If a marine is alone, they have 60% less fuel and 50% less damage each.
This means it is helpful if apart, but ultimately a great nerf to the item if you are in a group of 3. (Currently Thing vs. Group of 3 = Marines win if they have flame) People then start thinking, "What if they are together in a group? What is the difference?" Well, first of all both won't be able to shoot at the same time if they are being targeted. Imagine 2 flamers vs 1 Thing (or 2 marines vs 1 zealot). One of the 2 will always have to keep moving to avoid dying by the Thing. Even then, both flamers in the group will not always be shooting at the Thing. One may be shooting at in the front, and the other stuck in the back. Also, throwing a flamer away from the group and locking wouldn't result in a tough fight anymore. Currently, if you engage a group and throw the flamer outside and try to kill it, its a tough fight because so much damage per second. Alone, however, this much damage wouldn't be done.
The primary way the flamethrower mechanics would change for the better is it really doesn't matter if The Thing spawned next to the flame. You can always find it and use it again. The damage is less, so its still useful but not OP in any way. The fuel is also less, so its more of a treasure . More people can even use it (2 flamethrowers, remember?) so teamwork matters, and so does who you let have the flame.
What else would this offer?
Well, lets think logically. If grenades and molotovs are your only real damage dealers, and you have a limited amount, you will always want to travel to the Infernal Forge (My new name for it because it sounds cool) to get better weapons. (The flame) What did we just do? We just killed 2 birds with one stone. We just fixed volatile mechanics of the flamethrower AND promoted marines to move across the map and to NOT CAMP.
So that's my first idea. :3
Again, just theory-crafting. Feedback?
To expand upon my theory crafting, I meant you would not be camping because you would continuously be making trips for more fuel.
If we take a more literal approach to what Vic is saying (because he wasn't quite clear on the actual statistics of a flamethrower change), then we can guess he means something along the following:
Flamethrower fuel nerfed by 70%.
Damage nerfed by 20%.
(Complete guesses)
My only issue with this is that the experienced marines will not usually give a crap about the flame, urging people to stay together. However, the marine with the flame will always want to go and refuel. If they listen to the experienced marine, the flamethrower has just been nerfed to shit and is useless. If they go with a small group of marines to refuel they are most likely to die. In most situations in would be more beneficial to just camp comms than to go refuel. Which just makes the flamethrower nerfed to shit and useless.
IDK :/ Maybe I'm reading this wrong.
Flamethrower fuel nerfed by 70%.
Damage nerfed by 20%.
(Complete guesses)
My only issue with this is that the experienced marines will not usually give a crap about the flame, urging people to stay together. However, the marine with the flame will always want to go and refuel. If they listen to the experienced marine, the flamethrower has just been nerfed to shit and is useless. If they go with a small group of marines to refuel they are most likely to die. In most situations in would be more beneficial to just camp comms than to go refuel. Which just makes the flamethrower nerfed to shit and useless.
IDK :/ Maybe I'm reading this wrong.
In my personal opinion, the Flamethrower should be able to take out 50% of the things health when at full capacity, regardless of the things starting health.
I think we should be a little hesitant with adding new buildings, unless we want to switch to a 1-2 map game, in which we could potentially add LOTS of new buildings, as we would have much more room.
With this said, I think a re-fueling station would be cool, but would require a detriment.
RE-FUELING STATION IDEAS
-Possibly make it explode if killed, making it a possible trap for the thing, or for marines. (Needs further thought)
-Replace the generator with a 'Fuel System' that recharges fuel, or has a limited amount, making it so that marines can choose to use the fuel for the EVAC machine, or flame thrower. (Or possible other items implemented at a future date...*Wink Wink*)
I think this is great chance for some amazing changes, let's use it wisely
-PERP
P.S.- I believe that about 8 Meds spawn per game, although I've heard it can vary down to 7?
I think we should be a little hesitant with adding new buildings, unless we want to switch to a 1-2 map game, in which we could potentially add LOTS of new buildings, as we would have much more room.
With this said, I think a re-fueling station would be cool, but would require a detriment.
RE-FUELING STATION IDEAS
-Possibly make it explode if killed, making it a possible trap for the thing, or for marines. (Needs further thought)
-Replace the generator with a 'Fuel System' that recharges fuel, or has a limited amount, making it so that marines can choose to use the fuel for the EVAC machine, or flame thrower. (Or possible other items implemented at a future date...*Wink Wink*)
I think this is great chance for some amazing changes, let's use it wisely
-PERP
P.S.- I believe that about 8 Meds spawn per game, although I've heard it can vary down to 7?
